Making Sense episode #412
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Sam Harris speaks with Rutger Bregman about Rutger’s new book, Moral Ambition: Stop Wasting Your Talent and Start Making a Difference. They discuss why it seems like we are at the hinge of human history, wealth inequality, how altruism should be rewarded, how we should think about philanthropic billionaires, effective altruism, why empathy is overrated, moral entrepreneurship, universal basic income, work and meaning, existential risk, and other topics.
Rutger Bregman is a Dutch historian and author. His books Utopia for Realists (2017) and Humankind (2020) have sold over 2 million copies and have been translated into 46 languages. In 2024, he co-founded The School for Moral Ambition, a non-profit inspired by his book Moral Ambition: Stop Wasting Your Talent and Start Making a Difference (Dutch edition 2024), which helps ambitious people tackle the world’s most pressing problems. The English edition of Moral Ambition will be released on May 6, 2025.
Website: rutgerbregman.com
X: @rcbregman
📝 Transcript
Transcribing... This may take a few minutes.
Top Comments
@91ir07
Thanks for talking about this, Sam. I have seen on a local level, whether coaching high-school basketball, living in a large family, or going out into the community to practice my Catholic educated social teaching, that when we uplift the least among us, we all are more likely to prosper. This is true economically (I'd argue morally as well). In Chicago, I analyze data regarding substance use disorders and treatment. As taxpayers, we pay less in hospital bills and law enforcement costs by offering treatment options rather than criminalizing addiction. I also enjoy discussions about the interconnectivity of life on this planet, and how one region's wealth is sometimes directly caused by another region's pain. The late Thich Nhat Hanh gave beautiful talks on this.
24 likes
@rutger.bregman
Thanks for having me, Sam! Really enjoyed the conversation. I promise I’ll look slightly less vitamin D–deficient next time ☀️😅
292 likes
@DAH55100
Rutger, I know it was a lighthearted remark to refer to the Netherlands as 'a country no one gives a shit about'.
As an outlander who has lived there, let me assure you that your country is greatly valued and appreciated.
45 likes
@ethosphane
I absolutely f@#$ing love you guys. Thank you for elevating the conversation and the expectations of our potential as human beings.
44 likes
@amanieux
about philanthropy, i don't remember who famously said, " if you feel the need to give back, it means you took too much"
4 likes
@ChristianAlkjr
wow, spot on. The potential for growth via better redistribution of wealth, is indeed huge!
8 likes
@maxion5109
by wealth taxes and use the revenue to even out divides through social services. Philanthropy is a drop in the bucket
8 likes
@alanrobertson3172
Excellent guest and conversation.
8 likes
@slimdusty6328
pace of change with our local council rates and all have certainly been spectacular
1 likes
@captainwheelbarrow649
I love the idea of moral ambition but I don’t think more economic growth is the solution to our problems. We need to work a lot less and spend a lot less, share more, co operate more, compete less
204 likes
@bennihana2422
It's the housing/building theory of everything. Housing has risen dramatically as the number one cost facing families today, and it's not just in America. We've stopped building, and there are too many roadblocks in the building process. We need housing and transportation infrastructure.
39 likes
@Elintasokas
The Global Flourishing Study just dropped, and the wealthiest countries are often ranking lower than so-called "third world." There's more to life than material standards. Yay, we have higher GDP, but we feel without purpose and are disconnected from each other. Just because certain numbers are up doesn't necessarily mean "everything is getting better."
30 likes
@chriscopeman8820
Mention of our relationship to the natural world and our dependance on resources seems appropriate here.
4 likes
@aroemaliuged4776
Maybe start with a better tax system
13 likes
@jordanedgeley6601
Read his book human kind, really benefited from it. Cool to see him here!